A Conversation with Veteran Sports Writer Mike Shalin

The name Don Mattingly can invoke a multitude of feelings for many longtime baseball fans in the area, most of them positive. He was the captain of the New York Yankees until his retirement after the 1995 season, picking up nine Gold Gloves, a 1984 AL batting title, the 1985 AL MVP award, and numerous additional honors along the way.  A lifetime .307 hitter, for some he was the only bright spot for a Yankees franchise that had many low points in the late ‘80s and early ‘90s. 

Sports writer Mike Shalin, who covered the Yankees for the New York Post in the early ‘80s before switching to the Red Sox for the Boston Herald from 1983 to 1995, knew that the opportunity to write a book about one of baseball’s most popular players was too good to pass up.

Although Mattingly was notoriously stubborn about not having a biography written about his life, thanks to their friendship over the years he agreed to help Shalin gather the information he needed for "Donnie Baseball," now available on the Kindle, Amazon.com and in many bookstores.

Presently the manager for the Los Angeles Dodgers, and continuing his dedication to his own foundation, “Mattingly Charities” (http://www.mattinglybaseball.com/charities.html), Mattingly provided the author with a plethora of ammunition describing his life in and out of baseball and how difficult a decision it was to finally hang up the spikes.

Monroe Patch was able to catch up with Shalin, now a freelance writer and official scorer for the Red Sox, before his book discussion at the Edith Wheeler Memorial Library, where he was able to share his thoughts on everything from Don’s lasting impression on the franchise to his current Hall of Fame prospects.

Don Mattingly is a particularly well-loved sports icon in Fairfield County. Why did you choose to write a book on "The Hitman"?

I didn't ... it chose me. I received a tip on Facebook that Triumph Books was looking to do a book on Don Mattingly. I was on the Yankee beat (in the early '80s), and was leaving just as he was arriving. I thought, "Why not?"

People ask how can a guy from Boston write a book about a guy from New York? And my answer to that is I’m from New York and he’s from Indiana. It just seemed to be a natural fit. Having him sit down for two lengthy interviews when he had never been willing to do any of this stuff before ... he liked the connection too.

You have a unique position on the Yankees-Red Sox rivalry, having covered both teams for the New York Post and the Boston Herald. How has it changed from the late '70s, through the late '90s to as we know it today?

The only change I see is the fact that the Red Sox have won it twice.  The inbred inferiority complex that the city of Boston has for the city of New York in general was incredible. But to not only come back in the 2004 ALCS but to do it in the way they did ... I was the official scorer for that Game 4, and the Red Sox players were wishing the Yankees well in the outfield before the game.

Mariano Rivera, who never walks anybody, walks Kevin Millar, who never walks. Then Roberts pinch runs, who wasn’t even there before the trade deadline ... steals second by about an inch. Mueller gets the hit, and then things start happening.

It was almost as if all the years of frustration, and I was there in '86 when the Mets beat them, started going the other way. Winning again in 2007 changed the rivalry, and now it's truly a rivalry. The Yankees came back and won in 2009, and a lot of people expect both teams to be there at the end this year, which I do too. 

You are a Hall of Fame voter. How did you view those eligible players that were linked to steroids, such as Mark McGwire’s first time on the ballot in 2007?

Depends on what day you ask me. I tend to be a classic fence-sitter when it comes to these guys, but with McGwire at least I have the fall-back of "well, was he that great anyway?" At this point in time, my feeling is I'm going to vote for all of them if they deserve it. If I feel their career was created by steroids, i.e. Sammy Sosa, Palmiero, etc., I won’t vote for them.

Has your view on steroids in the game changed over time, with Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens both coming up for a vote soon?

I have a hard time not voting for Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens when they come up. There's always been mitigating circumstances in baseball numbers ... there are spit-ballers in the Hall, there are guys who hit .400 in an era when everybody hit .350, high mounds, low mounds, no blacks, no Latins. That’s my opinion this week, but I change a lot on this.

Roger Clemens is on trial now, but in three years he'll be on the ballot and I know he was a Hall of Famer before he messed around with this stuff. Until we quantify, and there's no way we can, what percentage of the pitchers and hitters were on it ... how do we know? All I know is that Barry Bonds was a great player.

Can you imagine the celebration in Cooperstown when these guys start getting in? Especially Pete Rose, who I feel is rightfully not on the ballot. Had he come out and admitted in the beginning, things would've been fine by now.

The Hall of Fame is always going to be tainted from now on. You watch guys like Granderson, Bautista ... everybody's going to be doubted now. Somebody even advanced a theory to me "look how Jeter's gone downhill since A-Rod got caught." Please ... if you can't trust Derek Jeter, the game has gone to hell.

In his 11^th year on the ballot, Mattingly garnered just 13.6% of writers votes. Did you vote for him?

I do now. I started voting for him about midway through, when I started putting his numbers up against the steroid guys, when I invoked the Koufax rule. Sandy Koufax was great for six years, Mattingly was great for six years.

Mattingly and Kirby Puckett have almost identical careers, but Kirby has the two championships. I think he's a Hall of Famer. I'd go as far as to say the guy he battled in New York, Keith Hernandez, is a Hall of Famer because Hernandez was the best defensive first baseman I ever saw.

It’s almost like the Hall of Fame needs guys like Don Mattingly, so I'll continue to vote for him. I often say that Mattingly is Jeter without the rings ... well, imagine if Jeter is voted in and the same year the Veterans Committee votes in Mattingly. Good luck trying to get a room in Cooperstown that weekend.

In "Donnie Baseball," you discuss how close Mattingly was to be traded on several occasions. Were any of the efforts sincere, or was it more just posturing by the Boss?

(Yankees announcer) Suzyn Waldman thinks that was all BS because there’s no way George Steinbrenner would've traded his "son." I tend to agree with that. But it got pretty interesting after '88 when Donnie's deal with the Boss was up. Dallas (Green) came in and had to show he was in control, so suddenly there's a rumor of a trade for Will Clark, and other rumors. I don’t think any of it was ever serious.

Stump Merrill famously threatened to bench him back in August of 1991 for refusing to cut his hair. Did Mattingly feel as though Steinbrenner was behind the demand, even though he was out of baseball at that point?

He DID bench him, and he missed one game. Mattingly felt it was Gene Michael behind that. George wasn't there then, and if he was there it would've been handled differently. He says George would've called him in, and said "we need to you to get a haircut by Friday" and that would've been that.

But Stump came to him during batting practice and told him that he either gets it done before the game or he wasn't playing. So Donnie said, "Okay, I'm not playing."

This was the closest thing to controversy surrounding Mattingly. He felt he was being singled out unnecessarily.

You mention in the book that it was nearly impossible to find a single person who had a bad thing to say about him. Why do you think Mattingly became such a universally-beloved sports figure?

Well, and I've caught heat about this from reviewers and critics, that this book was "hero worship." Don Mattingly wasn't my hero. But if there was anything negative to say, I would've found it. I worked for the New York Post for two-and-a-half years ... if there was anything negative, I was going to find it. I was there the night they wrote the headline "Headless Body Found in Topless Bar," so I know what negative is.

There was universal respect. Some people were questioning his managerial role because it's new, but that was it. Jeter is catching heat for this All Star Game thing (choosing to not attend the game or festivities in Arizona), and Mattingly’s closest thing was not getting a haircut. If there was anything negative to say it would've been in the book, because you have to have balance.

But out in LA right now ... you won't win without a closer. And with (Jonathan) Broxton hurt, they don't have a closer. But for a lot of people, that falls on the manager.

I talked to guys like (Mark) Teixiera and (Jason) Giambi ... Tex still has his baseball cards on his wall. Pat Kelly used to get dressed the exact same way as Donnie by watching him in the clubhouse. They all looked up to him.

You had a chance to interview the Core 4 (Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera, Andy Pettite and Jorge Posada) for the book. How do they view Mattingly's legacy, and his impact on their future championship teams?

All four of them loved Mattingly. I'm not sure Rivera does this for every interview, but at the end he actually thanked me for asking him about Mattingly. As a rookie his locker was right next to Mattingly's, and as a religious man he felt blessed that Donnie was in his life at that time to learn under him.

To me, it just adds another twist to an incredibly ironic story. The Yankees win the World Series in ’77 and ’78, then lose the Series in ’81. He gets there in '82, then nothing until 1994 when they're running away with the division. Then boom ... the strike happens and ends the season. [In] '95 they get to the playoffs, are up 2-0, and lose in 5 games. Then he comes back as a coach (in 2004) and they don't win it. And then he goes away (to become Dodgers manager, in 2008) and they win it (in 2009)! You couldn't make up what happened to Don Mattingly.

Mattingly played for some great managers in his career, such as Billy Martin, Lou Piniella and Buck Showalter. Who had the most profound effect on him?

Lou Piniella. He was a teammate, a batting coach, a manager and a general manager. He credits Piniella with a lot of things, most importantly his power swing. He said Piniella taught him how to shift his weight when swinging.

He found Billy interesting, but with Mattingly I don't think stuff like that (controversies surrounding Martin) bothered him.

It's been rumored that the reason Yankee management (namely general manager Brian Cashman) decided not to hire Mattingly as manager following Joe Torre's departure in 2007 was because they did not want to have to fire him somewhere down the line. Do you buy this explanation as to why Joe Girardi was ultimately hired?

This was brought up to me after the book came out. But you have to remember too, that Cashman hired the National League Manager of the Year. So nobody's going to come down on him for that decision.

But Don did feel that had George Steinbrenner been at full capacity during that interview, that he would've gotten the job. I think in the long run it’ll be better for Don that he didn't get that job. But you never know what will happen in the future.

I was talking to (Baltimore manager Buck) Showalter the other night, and mentioned that after new management takes over in Los Angeles, that Don and (GM Ned) Coletti might be fired. His ears perked up, because if that happens you can bet you'll see Mattingly sitting in the Orioles dugout the next day.

Has Mattingly been able to provide you with any feedback about your book yet?

He didn't read the book, but Tre Hillman (his bench coach) did and loved it. I just feel honored and proud to have my name forever linked with his (through this book). I've done a lot of neat things in this business. I've covered the Olympics, 15 World Series, the Stanley Cup Finals ... all there is to cover.

Once in a while you lose track of it since sometimes it's just another deadline, just another story. I was in Lake Placid (for the 1980 Winter Olympics) ... not only was I there, I was there covering a hockey game that some regard as the greatest moment in sports. Fast forward 30 years, and now I have a book on the shelves about Don Mattingly. It's a great feeling.

Do you know what your next project will be yet?

Dennis "Oil Can" Boyd, the biography. There's some people who better take cover with this one. If 80% of the stuff he says is true, and I think it is, this will be a good read. He didn't handle a lot of things well such as racism, substance abuse. This will all come out in the book.